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Thread: Advice on Bremont Airco Mach 2 Accuracy

  1. #1
    Junior Member john64's Avatar
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    Advice on Bremont Airco Mach 2 Accuracy

    Hi,

    I am looking for some advice and knowledge from our community of Bremont owners and enthusiasts about accuracy.

    I bought my Bremont Airco Mach 2 (Automatic) new at my local Bremont AD. And I am really happy with it generally, its a great watch to wear and also just look at.

    The watch is COSC rated, and was bought in March 2020, so at this point its approximately half way through its 3-year warranty.

    But, because I wear my watches in rotation, and usually only for a week at a time, it only gets some wrist time for 1 week every 2 months or so. The rest of the time it remains safe in a storage box.

    Each time I swap watches, I start a new timing run on the Watchtracker App that I use on my IPhone.

    I usually enter a data point each day, and try to keep near to the same time of day,

    Overnight, the watch I am currently using is placed into a watch winder which operates for 6 hours.

    The watchtracker app usually shows the spd range that averages just a little more that 6 spd, with individual daily dates in the range 4 spd to 7 spd. , so overall average is a shade outside COSC and daily rates are sometimes outside COSC.


    So, I have some questions that perhaps you could answer or advise me from your knowledge of the performance of your Bremont watches.

    1. If a watch has been in storage for, say, 2 months, and then wound fully and worn, is it ok or sensible to start a timing run immediately, or should I really wear it for a number of days (how many ?) before even bothering to start a timing run, to get a better understanding of true performance (I suppose I mean, does it take a few days to bed in each time itís worn after a gap in use ) ?

    2. Given the usage pattern, do you think this is about the best spd performance I can expect against the COSC standard (it really is on the upper limit), it should it still perform better ? What spd would you expect or accept given this usage ?

    3. Resting Position. So I have tried crown down resting position and also crown up resting position. I did seem to get a slightly better result crown up, although even that I found the watch having a spd of 4.3 one day, and 6.2 the next.
    What is the best resting position for Bremont Automatic Watches (eg AIRCO) so lose a few seconds per day ?

    4. Should I contact my AD (who I have a great relationship with) and talk to them about it, and possibly look at sending the watch back to Bremont for regulation either now, or wait a bit as I still have approx 18 months warranty ? I would only send my watch back via the AD, I do not want to send the watch to Bremont directly.

    5. Should I contact Bremont directly and see what they say ?

    I know that its pretty close to COSC, and I am not unduly concerned, I just would be happier if it was a bit under the 6 spd, or should I just live with it ?


    Many thanks for reading, and I would be grateful for any advice, suggestions or ideas.

    Cheers,

    John.
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    1. 1964 Omega Seamaster Deville Automatic
    2. 2020 Mathey-Tissot GMT Pepsi
    3. 2020 Bremont Airco Mach 2
    4. 2019 Rolex DateJust 41 Model : 126300 White Dial Roman Jubilee
    5. 2017 Omega SeaMaster DIVER 300M Commander's Watch 212.32.41.20.04.001
    6. 2015 Tudor Black Bay Blue 79220B
    7. 2014 Omega SeaMaster Diver 300M 212.30.41.20.01.003
    8. 2014 Rolex SubC 114060
    9. Citizen Men's Eco-Drive Diver BN0100-51E

  2. #2
    I would think like any mechanical device a watch will require a small ‘warning up’ period. Not long though, I’d allow an hour at most.

    However, do you not think that you’re may be overthinking the accuracy. In your own words the daily rate is 4spd to 7spd which mostly is within the COSC specs. If they average outside it must be by a very slim margin. Given the potential inaccuracy of an app, manual inputs etc. You’ll probably find that if the watch went back to Bremont they’d test it within spec.

  3. #3
    Junior Member john64's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by theancientmariner View Post
    I would think like any mechanical device a watch will require a small ‘warning up’ period. Not long though, I’d allow an hour at most.

    However, do you not think that you’re may be overthinking the accuracy. In your own words the daily rate is 4spd to 7spd which mostly is within the COSC specs. If they average outside it must be by a very slim margin. Given the potential inaccuracy of an app, manual inputs etc. You’ll probably find that if the watch went back to Bremont they’d test it within spec.


    Thanks for the reply.

    I may indeed be overthinking the accuracy. That’s why I included that I wasn’t overly concerned about it, and also questioned wether I should live with it.

    And, lets be fair, its not too bad really, and I haven’t tried resting the watch in other positions other than crown up and crown down.

    Part of the question was for me to learn a bit about the topic from experts and enthusiasts, from their views and answers. For instance your view that a small warming up period might be no more than an hour. Always trying to learn.

    I am happy with the app, other the the manual input element (reaction speed) as you pointed out.

    As an aside, perhaps over concentration on accuracy is not really required here, but there is a standard to measure against.

    My background is from a industry with extremely low tolerances on variables such as time, distance, specification etc. Actually to the point of life and death. So its important to me sometimes.
    I am willing to concede sometimes that travels across into personal life and hobbies sometimes, that’s just me, we are all different I suppose.

    Thanks again.
    Last edited by john64; 08-13-2021 at 09:18 AM.
    1. 1964 Omega Seamaster Deville Automatic
    2. 2020 Mathey-Tissot GMT Pepsi
    3. 2020 Bremont Airco Mach 2
    4. 2019 Rolex DateJust 41 Model : 126300 White Dial Roman Jubilee
    5. 2017 Omega SeaMaster DIVER 300M Commander's Watch 212.32.41.20.04.001
    6. 2015 Tudor Black Bay Blue 79220B
    7. 2014 Omega SeaMaster Diver 300M 212.30.41.20.01.003
    8. 2014 Rolex SubC 114060
    9. Citizen Men's Eco-Drive Diver BN0100-51E

  4. #4
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by john64 View Post
    Hi,

    I am looking for some advice and knowledge from our community of Bremont owners and enthusiasts about accuracy.

    I bought my Bremont Airco Mach 2 (Automatic) new at my local Bremont AD. And I am really happy with it generally, its a great watch to wear and also just look at.

    The watch is COSC rated, and was bought in March 2020, so at this point its approximately half way through its 3-year warranty.

    But, because I wear my watches in rotation, and usually only for a week at a time, it only gets some wrist time for 1 week every 2 months or so. The rest of the time it remains safe in a storage box.

    Each time I swap watches, I start a new timing run on the Watchtracker App that I use on my IPhone.

    I usually enter a data point each day, and try to keep near to the same time of day,

    Overnight, the watch I am currently using is placed into a watch winder which operates for 6 hours.

    The watchtracker app usually shows the spd range that averages just a little more that 6 spd, with individual daily dates in the range 4 spd to 7 spd. , so overall average is a shade outside COSC and daily rates are sometimes outside COSC.


    So, I have some questions that perhaps you could answer or advise me from your knowledge of the performance of your Bremont watches.

    1. If a watch has been in storage for, say, 2 months, and then wound fully and worn, is it ok or sensible to start a timing run immediately, or should I really wear it for a number of days (how many ?) before even bothering to start a timing run, to get a better understanding of true performance (I suppose I mean, does it take a few days to bed in each time it’s worn after a gap in use ) ?

    2. Given the usage pattern, do you think this is about the best spd performance I can expect against the COSC standard (it really is on the upper limit), it should it still perform better ? What spd would you expect or accept given this usage ?

    3. Resting Position. So I have tried crown down resting position and also crown up resting position. I did seem to get a slightly better result crown up, although even that I found the watch having a spd of 4.3 one day, and 6.2 the next.
    What is the best resting position for Bremont Automatic Watches (eg AIRCO) so lose a few seconds per day ?

    4. Should I contact my AD (who I have a great relationship with) and talk to them about it, and possibly look at sending the watch back to Bremont for regulation either now, or wait a bit as I still have approx 18 months warranty ? I would only send my watch back via the AD, I do not want to send the watch to Bremont directly.

    5. Should I contact Bremont directly and see what they say ?

    I know that its pretty close to COSC, and I am not unduly concerned, I just would be happier if it was a bit under the 6 spd, or should I just live with it ?


    Many thanks for reading, and I would be grateful for any advice, suggestions or ideas.

    Cheers,

    John.

    Sir, if I was worried about how many seconds my watch gains or losses time I would have bought myself a quartz watch.
    I change my watches every two to three days and so far my Bremonts have been excellent time keepers.
    Enjoy your AIRCO it is a lovely watch and thanks for sharing.

  5. #5
    Junior Member john64's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farhad19620 View Post
    Sir, if I was worried about how many seconds my watch gains or losses time I would have bought myself a quartz watch.
    I change my watches every two to three days and so far my Bremonts have been excellent time keepers.
    Enjoy your AIRCO it is a lovely watch and thanks for sharing.
    Hi,

    Thanks for the reply.

    Yes, I am aware about the advantages and disadvantages of automatic v Quartz watches. I do indeed have 2 quartz watches amongst my collection, and I like them very much.

    I am not worried, I am interested in the topic.

    Enjoy your day


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by john64; 08-14-2021 at 08:55 AM.
    1. 1964 Omega Seamaster Deville Automatic
    2. 2020 Mathey-Tissot GMT Pepsi
    3. 2020 Bremont Airco Mach 2
    4. 2019 Rolex DateJust 41 Model : 126300 White Dial Roman Jubilee
    5. 2017 Omega SeaMaster DIVER 300M Commander's Watch 212.32.41.20.04.001
    6. 2015 Tudor Black Bay Blue 79220B
    7. 2014 Omega SeaMaster Diver 300M 212.30.41.20.01.003
    8. 2014 Rolex SubC 114060
    9. Citizen Men's Eco-Drive Diver BN0100-51E

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by john64 View Post
    Hi,

    Thanks for the reply.

    Yes, I am aware about the advantages and disadvantages of automatic v Quartz watches. I do indeed have 1 quartz watch amongst my collection, and I like it very much.

    I am not worried, I am interested in the topic.

    Enjoy your day


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I've got 4 quartz vs 6 automatic and the quartz' get next to no wrist time.
    One of them, a Rado Diastar from 2001 never seems to gain or lose at all.
    By contrast my 2531.80 loses about 15 seconds a day and really needs a service

  7. #7
    Moderator RedsBluesGreens's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john64 View Post

    1. If a watch has been in storage for, say, 2 months, and then wound fully and worn, is it ok or sensible to start a timing run immediately, or should I really wear it for a number of days (how many ?) before even bothering to start a timing run, to get a better understanding of true performance (I suppose I mean, does it take a few days to bed in each time it’s worn after a gap in use ) ?
    I'm not aware of anything official on this exact question but broadly speaking the watches accuracy is related to the amount of 'wind' in the mainspring: as the spring tension 'unwinds', the mainspring will provide less torque through the movement, and ultimately to the balance, which will 'swing' less, and thus the time for one 'motion' of the balance drops, and the movement speeds up.


    2. Given the usage pattern, do you think this is about the best spd performance I can expect against the COSC standard (it really is on the upper limit), it should it still perform better ? What spd would you expect or accept given this usage ?
    Hard to say, fully wind the watch and time again, see how you get on. It is so individual that there really is no 'one answer fits all' here.


    3. Resting Position. So I have tried crown down resting position and also crown up resting position. I did seem to get a slightly better result crown up, although even that I found the watch having a spd of 4.3 one day, and 6.2 the next.
    What is the best resting position for Bremont Automatic Watches (eg AIRCO) so lose a few seconds per day ?
    Generally dial up is classed as being the position which minimises loss, but that will ultimately vary by movement. If you have a COSC to hand, look at the positions listed on there and the results - sometimes quite a variation.


    4. Should I contact my AD (who I have a great relationship with) and talk to them about it, and possibly look at sending the watch back to Bremont for regulation either now, or wait a bit as I still have approx 18 months warranty ? I would only send my watch back via the AD, I do not want to send the watch to Bremont directly.

    5. Should I contact Bremont directly and see what they say ?

    I know that its pretty close to COSC, and I am not unduly concerned, I just would be happier if it was a bit under the 6 spd, or should I just live with it ?
    Personally, no. As theancientmariner says, broadly speaking you're within COSC specifications, so really any available adjustment at Bremont HQ will yield a small result IMO - and indeed on a professional level timing machine, it may well drop within the +6/-4. Until it becomes a deviation from the datum (ie, the time that is actually is versus what the watch says), I'd live with it.

    I hope this helps,

    J.

  8. #8
    Junior Member john64's Avatar
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    Thank you so much, that helps me a lot in my understanding and really the way to look at this.

    I took a look at the COSC certificate for the AIRCO and looking at the individual positions listed, the Crown UP (3H) position performed the best by quite a margin (during the testing), so I think i will do a little more experimentation and see what else I observe. As another poster identified, there is also user error, the actual process of pressing the timing button on the phone app.

    Thank you for your answers to the specific questions I had, that’s very kind of you to take the time to do that, and I appreciate it.

    There is no obvious reason to contact BREMONT at this time, and so I will just continue to observe, and wear the watch whenever I can.

    Thanks again.

    John.
    Last edited by john64; 08-14-2021 at 11:50 AM.
    1. 1964 Omega Seamaster Deville Automatic
    2. 2020 Mathey-Tissot GMT Pepsi
    3. 2020 Bremont Airco Mach 2
    4. 2019 Rolex DateJust 41 Model : 126300 White Dial Roman Jubilee
    5. 2017 Omega SeaMaster DIVER 300M Commander's Watch 212.32.41.20.04.001
    6. 2015 Tudor Black Bay Blue 79220B
    7. 2014 Omega SeaMaster Diver 300M 212.30.41.20.01.003
    8. 2014 Rolex SubC 114060
    9. Citizen Men's Eco-Drive Diver BN0100-51E

  9. #9
    Moderator RedsBluesGreens's Avatar
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    My pleasure, John - do get involved with the other discussions and topics on the forum, Iím sure your thoughts would be most welcome.

  10. #10
    Junior Member john64's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedsBluesGreens View Post
    My pleasure, John - do get involved with the other discussions and topics on the forum, Iím sure your thoughts would be most welcome.
    Thanks again. I will definitely be getting involved more here, and hopefully to learn more as well.

    Cheers,

    John
    1. 1964 Omega Seamaster Deville Automatic
    2. 2020 Mathey-Tissot GMT Pepsi
    3. 2020 Bremont Airco Mach 2
    4. 2019 Rolex DateJust 41 Model : 126300 White Dial Roman Jubilee
    5. 2017 Omega SeaMaster DIVER 300M Commander's Watch 212.32.41.20.04.001
    6. 2015 Tudor Black Bay Blue 79220B
    7. 2014 Omega SeaMaster Diver 300M 212.30.41.20.01.003
    8. 2014 Rolex SubC 114060
    9. Citizen Men's Eco-Drive Diver BN0100-51E

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